IRC log of #novawebdev for Thursday, 2022-10-13

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jelkner!agenda11:35
LittleWebsterWarning: There are no items on the agenda!11:35
jelkner!add Discuss communication expectations (email and irc) and how to use these to learn together.11:36
LittleWebsterSuccess: "Discuss communication expectations (email and irc) and how to use these to learn together." has been added to the agenda.11:36
jelkner!add Demonstrate Robot chasing Player in robots.py11:37
LittleWebsterSuccess: "Demonstrate Robot chasing Player in robots.py" has been added to the agenda.11:37
jelkner!agenda11:37
LittleWebsterThis is the agenda for the next meeting:11:37
LittleWebsterDiscuss communication expectations (email and irc) and how to use these to learn together. (added by jelkner)11:37
LittleWebsterDemonstrate Robot chasing Player in robots.py (added by jelkner)11:37
jelknerGood morning, abuchholz1 12:21
jelknerI'm trying to get Dafni into this chat now.12:21
jelknerShe will be the bridge between the group working on the MCSS website in my first period class.12:21
jelknerAnd me, you, and spencer12:21
abuchholz1Cool, I'm here for a bit (15 minutes before I have to go) to see if spencer will join. He said he had smth urgent to discuss. 12:22
jelknerYou need to be firm, abuchholz1, if you want me to back you up.12:22
abuchholz1I believe this is about server access so I kinda have to be involved12:23
abuchholz1If it's something else then yeah, would like it handled by one of the capstone students12:23
jelknerYes, if you can get him server access, that is good.12:23
jelknerYou were holding off I believe to prevent things from breaking12:24
jelknerbut if it breaks, it breaks12:24
abuchholz1Yeah, I'm a little worried because its not just MCSS on the server12:24
jelknerif he wants access, give it to him12:24
jelknerAhh12:24
jelknerThat is a *huge* problem12:24
jelknerYou'll be on at 3 pm today, yes?12:24
abuchholz1mmalo is on there and another website Louis did12:24
jelknerWe can't give him access until it gets moved12:25
abuchholz1Yeah, should be able to make it at 3, I have an interview at 2:3012:25
jelknerGood luck with your interview.12:25
jelknerWith whom?12:25
abuchholz1Deloitte 12:25
jelknerURL?12:26
jelknerI can search12:26
abuchholz1https://www2.deloitte.com/us/en.html12:26
jelknermention your work on Business Tracker12:27
abuchholz1Will do!12:27
abuchholz1As for the server, we can have it moved12:27
abuchholz1currently their mail server is based in frankfurt12:27
abuchholz1which is closer to them than the US12:27
abuchholz1but their website is hosted in New Jersey 12:27
jelknerNew Jersey, where all the best things are! ;-)12:28
abuchholz1:)12:28
jelknerabuchholz1, Dafni is having trouble getting into irc on her school laptop012:28
abuchholz1We an talk about it this afternoon, it shouldn't take to long12:29
abuchholz1https://webchat.oftc.net/?channels=%23novawebdev that link works12:30
abuchholz1and irc.novawebdevelopment.org works as well12:30
jelknerGood morning, Dafni 12:31
jelknerYou're in!12:31
jelknerThanks, abuchholz112:32
abuchholz1I'll have to go soon, but if spencer does join tell him to email me whatever he needs added to the website, and that I'll try to figure out a plan this afternoon regarding server access12:33
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scooperHello Adrain, Dafni, Jelkner12:36
scooperHow are you guys doing??12:36
abuchholz1Hey spencer, I have 4 minutes, so it might be easier if you email me what you need me to do to the website and I'll figure out a plan this evening regarding access12:37
scooperOk Adrain, I'm sending you email righ now, will that be ok??12:38
abuchholz1That would be perfect, I'll do it as soon as possible. I'll talk to you all later, gotta get to class!12:39
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jelknerscooper, Adrian explained to me the problem12:41
jelknerthe MCSS website is hosted on the same machine as two other client projects12:41
jelknerit is dangerous to give you too much access until you're ready, since you could break things not only for MCSS, but for the other clients.12:41
jelknerWe can't allow that.12:41
jelknerSo we need to figure out how to reconfigure things.12:42
jelknerscooper, let me introduce you to dafni 12:42
jelknershe is a capstone student with NOVA Web Development this year12:42
jelknerShe is also in my class every other day at 8 am my time12:42
scooperNice to meet youDafni12:42
dafnihello!12:43
scooperNice to meet you Dafni12:43
jelknerso she will be an important communication bridge between many of us working together on this project12:43
jelknerscooper, dafni is focusing on front end web development12:46
jelknershe's the part of the team that can take something like this:12:46
jelknerhttps://bookjeff.gctaa.net/12:46
jelknerand make it look good on my phone!12:46
jelknershe, antonio and luke are an impressive team12:47
jelkneri know they will accomplish a lot this year12:47
scooperTheir template is great12:49
scooperJeff12:50
jelknerIt was their first Django app, scooper 12:50
jelknerI've been amazed at how fast they work.12:50
scooperJeff, I you still there?12:57
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jelknerI'm in class, scooper 13:13
jelknerso i can't always respond13:13
jelknerjust leave a message and wait for me to reply when i can13:14
scooperok sir13:16
jelknerhello, inana 16:39
inanahello world!16:39
jelknerLoL16:40
inanalol16:40
jelknerscooper, inana, aka Natalia, aka Nana16:40
jelkneris one of the 4 worker / owners of NOVA Web Development16:40
inanaHi scooper :)16:40
jelknerhe many not actually be at his computer at the moment, inana 16:40
jelknersince it has been a few hours since we last chatted16:41
jelknerand it is now 4:40 pm in Monrovia16:41
inanaOh, I see16:41
scooperI'm here Jeff16:41
jelknerbut he did say he was going to try to be here at 3 pm (7 pm his time)16:41
jelknerAh, scooper, there you are16:41
jelknersay hi to inana 16:41
scooperHi Inana16:42
inanaHi! :) Good to see you here16:42
jelknerI think inana is short for "I, Nana"16:42
scooperI will official join you guys by 7:30 my time Jeff16:42
jelknerok16:42
jelknerwe'll be here16:42
scooperI m uploading some Content for Adrian to view and publish it by tomorrow for MCSS.16:43
inanaNana is because my name is Natalia Cerna, so is the beginning of my name and the end of my last name scooper :)16:43
scooperWhich one you prefer me calling16:44
inanaBut jelkner  and some friends started calling me Nana,a few years ago16:44
inanaNana or Natalia, you pick! :)16:44
inanahow about you, Spencer is ok? scooper 16:44
jelknerPart of my goal today will be to get all the interns using this irc channel.16:45
scooperyes16:45
jelknerThe one-stop-shop will make it easier16:45
inanaCool scooper :)16:45
jelknerand the auto logging too16:45
inanaright16:45
inanaI remember when I started using IRC jelkner 16:45
jelkneryes, inana, that's how we did things back in the SchoolTool days16:46
inanaIt took some time to get use to it, but then it was easier. jelkner 16:46
jelkneri love it16:46
jelknerit fits my simple brain so well.16:46
inanaI know :)16:47
jelknerok, i will be leaving for lunch in 8 minutes16:47
jelknermaybe we can talk about MCSS a bit.16:47
inanaCool16:48
jelknerinana, i have to decide what to do with the MCSS website16:48
inanaSure16:48
jelknerwe can't keep it on the same server as other clients16:48
scooperI'm still following the chat jeff16:48
jelknerbut since scooper and the interns have a goal of learning Django16:48
jelknerkeeping it on LibreOrganize makes sense16:49
jelknerFor NOVALACIRO, I don't think so.16:49
jelknerI go out of my way to avoid doing the wrong thing due to conflict of interest16:49
jelknersince i'm part of nova web and novalaciro16:50
jelkneri think for novalaciro, the best thing would be to use may first for hosting everything16:50
jelknerwe need the bilingual feature16:50
jelknerbut they seem to have that16:50
jelknerinana, how much do you know about drupal?16:50
jelknersince LibreOrganize won't run on may first, but they have drupal16:51
inanaA little bit,I saw it just a few Times while David of Agaric was explaining to a partner jelkner 16:51
jelknerthe challenge would be migrating our content16:52
inanaat this point Louie, would know more16:52
jelkneri'll ask louie and adrian16:52
jelknerthat will be on the agenda for this afternoon16:52
inanaWe can try to see if the CMS that zOnny was working with fit us, the Django one that he was using with Tim, jelkner 16:53
inanaI don't remember the name now 16:53
inanabut I can try to figure it out16:53
jelknerif we are using may first for hosting, we start with what they offer16:53
jelkneri know what our needs are:16:53
jelkner1. *basic* content management16:54
jelkner2. email16:54
jelkner3. bilingual support16:54
jelknermay first website has a button like ours does16:54
jelknerthat switches between English and Spanish16:54
jelknerthat is just what NOVALACIRO needs16:55
jelknerokie dokie16:55
jelknerthe bell rang16:55
jelknerand my lunch is waiting for me inside the building16:55
jelkneri need to go...16:55
jelknerACTION logs off until after lunch16:55
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scooperJeff it's 4:56 on end I will join you later by 7:30, trying to leave and go home the file is huge to be completed right now, when I get home I will continue the upload.16:56
scooperInana16:56
scooperCatch you later16:57
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inanaACTION Away16:57
inanaACTION AFK16:58
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abuchholz1jelkner we meeting on BBB?19:04
jelknerGood evening, abuchholz1 19:09
jelknerthe gang is all here19:09
jelknercan we start?19:09
abuchholz1Are we gonna do this on IRC?19:10
jelkner+119:10
abuchholz1Ok I suppose19:10
jelkneri know you don't like it19:10
jelknerbut it will work so much better for the rest of us involved19:10
jelknerso i appreciate your indulgence with us19:10
abuchholz1Sure, if it's easier for others than this works19:11
jelknerso, here are our goals as i see them, and please let me know what you think:19:11
jelkner1. transition all nova web existing responsibilities to me19:12
jelknerand here i mean management resposibilities19:12
jelkner2. as 1 is happening, streamline and reduce the burdens so that it is doable by the new crew19:13
jelkneractually, that's it for now19:13
jelknerin april, i'll want to take stock and figure out whether this is indeed sustainable19:13
jelknerabuchholz1, thoughts?19:13
abuchholz1That sounds good to me. 19:14
jelknercool19:14
abuchholz1I'll be working this weekend on the Linode Servers19:14
jelknerawesome19:14
abuchholz1mainly moving stuff around and removing servers that aren't in use19:14
jelknercan you and i meet on bbb on saturday?19:14
abuchholz1Sure19:14
jelknerfor mcss, we should have them purchase a server for their website19:15
jelknerand give us access to it19:15
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jelkneri think what aaron is using in germany sounds like a good recommendation for them19:15
jelkneri want them to be billed, not us19:15
jelkneri'm going to try to do that with most of our clients19:16
jelknerhave them receive the bills (from linode or otherwise)19:16
jelknerso that we only bill for work, not hosting19:16
abuchholzI can look into that, probably would require creating a new account19:16
abuchholzfor them, but I'm not sure19:16
jelknercan we meet on bbb on saturday?19:17
jelkneroops19:17
jelkneryou already said sure19:17
jelknerlet's talk about that then19:17
jelknerwhat time?19:17
abuchholzYeah, we can discuss this more in depth then19:17
abuchholzThat sounds like a plan19:17
abuchholzand Stefan can also join us19:17
jelknerthat would be great19:17
jelkneri teach until 10 am19:17
jelknercan we meet right after that?19:17
abuchholzSure, I'll check with Stefan but I think that works19:18
jelknercool19:18
jelkneri want you to have time to work with dafni Luke_R and AntonioA 19:18
jelknerso i won't take up too much more time now19:18
abuchholzSounds good19:18
jelkneri want to look into migrating novalaciro to may first hosting19:18
jelknerwe can talk about that on saturday too19:19
abuchholzSure that sounds like a plan19:19
jelkneralright, anything else before i leave?19:19
jelknerspencer will be joining here in about 10 minutes19:19
abuchholzStefan can join Saturday19:19
jelknersweet19:19
jelkneranything else from me?19:20
jelknerping me when spencer arrives19:20
jelknerso we can talk with him19:20
abuchholzk19:20
inanayou need anything from me know jelkner ?19:20
jelknerinana, can you join us saturday19:21
jelknerthis is going to be a gradual process19:21
inana right19:21
jelkneri'll want to talk with you about specific clients as we figure out what to do with each of them19:21
jelknersince i'll be meeting with abuchholz and stefan on saturday19:22
jelkneri know a lot more after that19:22
inanaCool19:22
jelknertalk soon, inana 19:22
jelknerACTION changes status to away until pinged19:23
inanaGotta lunch now, brb 19:23
jelkner:away19:23
inanaACTION AWAY19:23
abuchholzAntonioA & Luke_R do you need help with smth in particular? Questions about LibreOrganize, etc?19:24
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jelknerperhaps i shouldn't leave just yet19:25
jelknerabuchholz, i'm thinking their next task should be to add rss feed to the blog19:26
abuchholzOk, that also works19:26
jelknerLibreOrganize is a big deal, so let's take it step-by-step19:26
jelknerand i'll talk with you more about that on saturday too19:26
abuchholz+119:27
abuchholzLuke_R & AntonioA if you need any help setting up the RSS feed just let me know. You can also ping me on Zulip and I'll respond pretty fast19:28
AntonioAAt this point we really only need access to the git repo, if we have any questions we will let you know.19:30
abuchholzCool, could I have your GitLab usernames please?19:30
AntonioAI don't have gitlab, let me make an account real quick.19:31
abuchholzcool19:32
AntonioAabuchholz, my username is AntonioAbela and Luke's is lukerisacher19:32
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abuchholzok cool, give me a second19:33
abuchholzhttps://gitlab.com/novawebdevelopment/the-blog19:33
AntonioAThanks!19:34
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abuchholzPlease submit a merge request, I would recommend creating a separate branch based on the branch titled "jelkner" and later submitting a merge request19:36
AntonioAOk, will do19:41
abuchholzIf you have any questions just let me know19:41
scooperAdrian19:44
scooperHOw are you doing?19:44
jelknerabuchholz, are you here?19:45
abuchholzYeah, sorry19:46
scooperIs the anyway round you can help, Trying sending the template through my google drive but this is the msg I keep getting: can't seem to load the app louncher  right now19:47
jelknerscooper, let me step in here for a minute19:48
jelknerwe can't keep asking abuchholz to do this19:48
jelknerthat's our agreement, he is moving on19:48
jelknerso if he breaks down now and says "oh, ok, let me do it"19:48
jelkneryou'll be back soon with another request19:49
jelknerit won't end19:49
jelknerwe need to fix the problem19:49
jelknerthe bigger problem, i mean19:49
jelknerwhich is to find a sustainable way to maintain the mcss website19:49
jelknerand to do that without funds19:50
scooperI tried fixing the problem and I failed, so I deem it necessary to consult the big man 19:50
jelknerwhich isn't going to be easy19:50
jelknersure, you should consult the big man19:50
abuchholz+1, the solution in my eyes is just giving scooper access to the server; I need to move it over to a separate server so that we don't have other partners information/website code19:50
jelknerultimately he understands19:50
jelkner+119:50
jelknerwe will talk about that this weekend19:51
jelkneri want it to be an mcss server, not a nova web development one19:51
jelknerscooper, i am nervous about all the responsibility i'll be taking on19:51
jelknerfor this to work, i need to scale that back to its minium19:52
jelknerso the plan is to have mcss purchase a virtual machine19:52
scooperJeff, Teach me I'm available to help you with the MCSS Website fully19:52
jelknerand abuchholz will migrate the website over to it19:53
jelkner+119:53
jelknerwhen aaron arrives, i'll ask him for the link to the host he uses in germany19:53
jelknerit costs less than $5 per month19:53
jelkneryou can ask the supe to purchase a year on it or something19:53
scooperWith a high speed19:54
jelknerthen you give us access to help you set it up19:54
jelknergermany is best, since the Internet connection to liberia is better from there19:54
jelknerand we can reach it from here without problem19:54
jelkneraaron had a doctor's appointment this afternoon19:55
abuchholzWe also need to discuss the MCSS email server and where that is going to be hosted jelkner 19:55
jelknerbut he said he would be here this evening19:55
abuchholzif you also want to move that off NWD's linode19:55
jelknerif not, i see him tomorrow morning19:55
jelknerabuchholz, yes, that's what i'm saying19:56
jelknerso good point19:56
jelknerbest plan would be a single mcss server that does both19:56
abuchholzSure19:56
abuchholzWe can figure out the details Saturday 19:56
jelkner+119:57
abuchholzACTION will be right back19:57
scooperJeff, do you want me to inform that Sup about our next step??19:58
scooperthe19:58
jelkner*definitely*!19:58
jelknerhe can look at this irc log too19:58
jelknerto see our conversation19:58
jelknerit is going to be his decision19:58
jelkneri can't keep paying for servers19:58
jelknerand i don't want to get the bill19:58
jelknerso it will be up to mcss to purchase their own virtual machine19:59
scooperIf MCSS have it own Server will you educate me how to upload contest base on my Boss request?20:00
jelknerwe can then do the work together to set it up20:00
jelknerbut i want the bill going to mcss, not me20:00
jelkneryes, scooper 20:00
jelknerthat's the point! ;-)20:00
jelkneronce mcss has it's own server, you can have full access20:00
jelknerbut you'll need to be careful20:00
scooperI know20:01
jelknerbut basic things can be done now20:01
jelknerand you can have full admin access20:01
jelknersince you work for mcss20:01
jelknerand it will be your employers server20:01
scooperI know you willing to educate me20:01
jelkner+120:01
jelknerthat we will do20:01
jelknerso i think that's all we need to talk about for now20:02
jelknernext steps:20:02
scooperONE MORE THING JEFF20:02
jelkner1. jelkner talks to arabach about the host he uses in germany20:02
jelkner2. jelkner talks to abuchholz and stefan about the migration plan20:03
jelkner3. jelkner sends scooper the url of the company20:03
scooperWho is arabach??20:03
jelkneraaron20:03
jelknerAaron Rabach20:03
abuchholzI have to go, but that sounds like a good plan Jeff! I'll see you on Saturday20:04
jelknerhe is the student sys admin20:04
jelknerhe is a senior20:04
scooperJeff20:04
scooperAdrain said I should send him the work I did today20:04
abuchholzYes, just this once scooper 20:05
abuchholzbut once you have the server and everything set up20:05
abuchholzI will no longer be responsible 20:05
jelknerabuchholz, i'm going to help you enforce that20:05
scooperNo problem 20:05
jelknersince i know it is a slippery slope20:05
jelkneri promised to do that20:06
jelknerand i will20:06
abuchholzcool20:06
scooperWhat do you mean Jeff "Slippery slope"20:06
abuchholzI have to go, but I'll be able to respond to Zulip messages20:06
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jelkneri just mean like i said, that once adrian starts saying "oh, ok, i'll do it this once"20:06
jelknerthen the next time you get in a bind, you'll naturally want to ask him again20:07
scooperGot you20:07
scooperhahahahah20:07
jelknerit's human nature20:07
jelknerso we have to be aware of it20:07
scooperIs the any plan for today????20:08
jelknerscooper, i still didn't get an email from either freena or jallah20:08
jelknermakes me sad20:08
jelknera nice email would make me happy20:08
jelknerwe can talk more about that on saturday morning20:08
jelknerthat was the plan for today20:09
jelknerwe're done here for now20:09
scooperFreena turn up that very day20:09
scooperbut unfortunately for her, MCSS Staff were using my office for interview20:10
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jelknerlet's talk saturday20:10
scooperso I ask to come the next day but she didn't turn up again, trying calling her but her phone was off20:10
jelknerbut somehow, some way, they need to be able to do stuff during the week20:11
jelknerif they can't, we won't make enough progress to make this worth while20:11
jelknerjallah has Internet at home20:11
jelknerat least some times20:11
jelknersince he messaged me earlier during the middle of the week20:11
scooperWe resschedule all the interns to meet in the lab Wednesday, Friday and Saturday20:12
jelknernice!20:12
jelknerthat is what we need20:12
scooperIt's mendatory that we all meeet twice a week for saturday class commence20:12
jelknerso they meet tomorrow20:12
scooper+120:12
scooperfrom 4-620:13
jelknertell them that a nice email from freena and jallah will make me feel they still love me ;-)20:13
scooperI promise to wait for them up to that hours20:13
jelknerok, scooper let's talk saturday20:13
scooperJeff20:13
scooperThough we said we have a lecture today20:14
jelkner?20:14
scooperThough you said we have a lecture toay20:14
jelkneri think you miss understood20:14
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jelknerthursday is a work day20:14
jelknerit is the day that i have the capstone interns for nova webdevelopment20:15
jelknerdafni, AntonioA, Luke, and Aaron20:15
scooperYes20:15
jelknerthey are all here20:15
jelknerwe make plans and do stuff20:15
jelknerthehedgeh0g, is aaron20:15
jelknerhe just joined20:15
scooperand you said you wanted me to be apart20:15
scooperfor introduction and also follow the activities that is going on20:16
jelknerif i recall (we can look in the logs), you asked to be included20:16
jelkneri said it was a good idea20:16
jelknerit's only if you want to20:16
jelknersince i know it is late for you20:16
jelknereach thursday at 3 pm EST (7 pm your time)20:16
jelknerwe'll be meeting here20:16
scooperThough it might seem late but a little knowledge will be gain right??20:17
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jelknerwell, it is really a planning and work session20:17
jelknerbut there will be folks here you can ask for help when you need it20:18
jelkneronce you get control of your own server, you'll need help20:18
jelknerhere is the time and place to come get it20:18
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thehedgeh0gif you want to use the same provider that I use, I'm currently using https://www.hetzner.com20:22
thehedgeh0gIf you want to use just one server for your needs, I have found the CPX31 or CX31 configurations to be the best for my needs.20:23
thehedgeh0gYour needs are different, but the CPX31/CX31 I have found to be my preferred servers20:23
thehedgeh0gpreferred configurations I mean20:23
thehedgeh0gyou can find all the cloud server configurations on https://www.hetzner.com/cloud20:25
thehedgeh0gthat specific page20:25
scooperI m get click the link20:26
scooperI just click the link to view what you are talking about20:27
scooperBut Jeff know what is appropriate for us at MCSS20:29
jelknerscooper, thehedgeh0g, adrian, and stefan know better than me20:31
jelkneri'll talk to adrian and stefan on saturday20:31
jelknerand send you the info after that20:32
scoopergood night from my end jef20:45
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jelknerinana, we made some good progress20:46
jelkneri'll contact you again after i meet with adrian and stefan on saturday20:47
inanaThat sounds good jelkner 20:47
inanareally glad you made some progress jelkner  :-)20:47
inanahow's your wife doing jelkner, is she feeling better? 20:49
inana!agenda20:50
LittleWebsterThis is the agenda for the next meeting:20:50
LittleWebsterDiscuss communication expectations (email and irc) and how to use these to learn together. (added by jelkner)20:50
LittleWebsterDemonstrate Robot chasing Player in robots.py (added by jelkner)20:50
jelknerinana, we now use this for class20:51
jelkneri need to think about adding another thursday meeting agenda20:52
jelknerbut i'm not going to think about that now20:52
jelknertoo many other things to do20:52
jelknerit fires at 8 am EST on saturdays20:52
jelknerat the start of my weekly class with the student in Monrovia20:53
inanaI see20:54
jelkneri revived this specifically for monrovia communications20:55
inanaI just was checking in case I missed something or have to be aware on the next agenda items Lol, jelkner 20:55
jelkneri'm glad you did, inana, since it made me think20:55
inanano problem with the agenda for your use right now20:55
jelknerbut i'll keep that in mind as things develop20:55
inanaI mean maybe is not a urgent issue20:56
inanabut yeah20:56
inanaI got your point20:56
inanagonna go jelkner 21:10
inanacya21:10
jelknerok inana 21:10
jelknerme too then21:10
jelknerc u soon!21:10
inanaHave a great rest of the day! jelkner 21:10
jelknerACTION logs out21:10
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jelkner!agenda22:34
LittleWebsterThis is the agenda for the next meeting:22:34
LittleWebsterDiscuss communication expectations (email and irc) and how to use these to learn together. (added by jelkner)22:34
LittleWebsterDemonstrate Robot chasing Player in robots.py (added by jelkner)22:34
jelkner!add Share the questions the attendance app team has22:35
LittleWebsterSuccess: "Share the questions the attendance app team has" has been added to the agenda.22:35
jelknerQuestions22:35
jelknerBrowser stats of teachers?22:35
jelknerHow best to ensure reliable accounting?22:35
jelknerunique database feature(s)22:35
jelknerSchool composition MCSS Schools22:35
jelknerAre there school districts?22:35
jelknerDo teachers:22:35
jelknerShare classrooms?22:35
jelknerSpecialize(do kids change classrooms for different classes?) or generalize(teach same students all day)?22:35
jelknerTeach multiple groups if children ? (A day, B day)22:35
jelknerIs attendance for just classes or should it include exams?22:35
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