IRC log of #jetrowebdev for Tuesday, 2025-08-05

klarios__ssh-ed25519 AAAAC3NzaC1lZDI1NTE5AAAAIKblBpzIUf8j6dJFHBc5UYzv6Lbugr4Pl3o+xlsVlcYS root@Lei00:02
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dcammueGood afternoon svaye 12:22
svayeGood afternoon dcammue 12:22
dcammueHow the bday party yesterday?12:22
dcammueAnd how you doing 12:22
svayeI am good, and it was great yesterday.12:23
dcammueThat's good news svaye 12:23
thomasboimahGood afternoon dcammue and svaye 12:24
dcammueGood afternoon thomasboimah 12:25
svayeGood afternoon thomasboimah 12:25
dcammueHow are you brother?12:25
dcammueGood morning jelkner 12:25
svayeGood morning jelkner 12:26
thomasboimahI'm Good dcammue and you?12:26
thomasboimahGood morning jelkner 12:26
jelknerGood afternoon dcammue and svaye!12:26
jelkneryou too thomasboimah 12:26
dcammueWelcome you all to our day to day activities 12:27
klarioshi all!12:29
jelknerYesterday i met with cjones, klarios, ved, devesh and vrishin to work on gnucash setup, and then spent the day setting up my classroom. This morning i started the wire transfer, today i'll finish setting up my room. No blockers.12:30
svayeYesterday I created a gitlab account, but thomasboimah couldn't had me to the repo because he's not an administrator (jelkner would have to do that). Today I have a business manager meeting with klarios. No blockers.12:30
svayeACTION done12:30
jelknerACTION done12:30
dcammueYesterday,  I read on gnucash learning guide for overall understanding of gnucash and today I will continue.  No blocker 12:30
dcammueACTION done12:30
thomasboimahYesterday, I modified the code for the Todo app to address Chris’s comments on Mulbah and Gabriel’s pull request and pushed the changes. Chris approved it and merged it into the main branch. I also received another email from Ms. Scholl asking me to help her update her website, since she is not yet familiar with Google Sites and can’t make the changes herself. After completing the update for her today, I plan to create some document12:30
thomasboimahation on how to make edits on Google Sites, so it can help her learn to do it herself. No blockers.12:30
thomasboimahACTION done12:30
svayeGood morning klarios 12:30
jelknergood morning cjones 12:31
jelknerdidn't expect to see you12:31
thomasboimahGood morning klarios and cjones 12:31
cjoneshi all - I just finished merging the PR, so thought I'd pop in here to celebrate =)12:31
svayeGood morning cjones 12:31
klariosyesterday I got se up with GNu cash and did some IT work for Magic broom among other things. Today I meet with svaye, we want to start entering the NWD accounts to GNU cash. No blockers12:31
klariosACTION done12:31
jelkneryes! let's do that first12:31
jelknerthen we won't need to detain you12:32
cjonesi can wait until you finish standup12:32
jelknerwe're only waiting on klarios 12:32
klarioswere done I think?12:32
jelknerno12:32
jelknerwe're done12:32
jelknerlol]12:32
klariosI finished12:32
jelknerwe rock!12:32
jelknerwe don't have a 10 minute meeting any more, we have a *2* minute meeting!12:33
jelknercjones, i was telling klarios yesterday how helpful i'm finding this12:33
jelknersince in about 2 minutes we get a broad overview of what is going on across our co-op so we can help orient ourselves12:33
cjones=) when team standups go well, they're awesome12:34
jelkner+112:34
cjonesi was excited to get to click that "merge" button in codeberg this morning12:34
jelknerthomasboimah, working with cjones on the ToDo project is going to be your top priority12:34
cjonesthanks @thomasboimah for making those changes!12:34
thomasboimahOKay12:35
jelknerwe can use that to really develop our skills as a dev team12:35
cjones(and in case you didn't see my note, I made one small change to the code before merging, to undo a change that I asked you to make but that I was wrong about)12:35
jelknerklarios, thomasboimah needs your help with Ms. Scholl12:35
jelknerklarios, do you have her phone number?12:36
jelknertime for you to learn a bit of customer management12:36
klariosNo jelkner, she hasnt responded to me in a bit12:36
thomasboimahI have it jelkner 12:36
klariosI can check back in with her12:36
jelknerthomasboimah, please give it to klarios 12:36
thomasboimahit is one the website12:36
thomasboimah*on*12:36
jelknerlol12:36
jelknerthere you go12:36
klariosahhh12:36
klariosill grab it from there12:37
jelknerthomasboimah, wait to hear from klarios before doing any more work12:37
thomasboimahokay12:37
jelknerthomasboimah, have you been tracking your hours?12:37
klariosI,ll message her today, hopefully she gets back12:37
thomasboimahYes!12:37
klariosoh jelkner business tracker works now lol12:38
jelknerklarios, if she doesn't, no additional changes will be made to her website12:38
jelknerthat will be her motivation12:38
jelknerthomasboimah, klarios, i'm sure she doesn't mean too12:38
klariosshe's been away for a long trip and with limited bandwidth so I assume its that12:38
jelknerbut when you get into pet projects like this with a customer, if you don't communicate expectations clearly12:39
jelknerthey will abuse you!12:39
jelknerthe requests for changes will be endless12:39
jelknerand you will be spending lots and lots of time12:39
jelknerwhile *not* getting paid12:39
jelkneryou'll starve12:39
jelknerwe can't have that12:39
jelknerklarios, this is your first rodeo12:40
jelknerso you don't yet have experience with this12:40
jelknerbut i can help guide you12:40
jelkneryou need to:12:40
jelkner1. Set clear expectations with the customer as to what will be charged for our work12:40
jelkner2. Communicate regularly and effectively as to what has been done, what will be done, and what the invoice will look like12:41
jelkner3. Send invoices on a regular basis and make sure you receive payment before incurring too much additional costs12:41
jelkneri've found that almost all the customers i've worked with are very happy when we do these things12:42
jelknersince uncertainty is one of the most uncomfortable feelings for we humans12:42
jelknerwhile feeling like you're on solid ground is good ;-)12:43
klarios+1 this is mostly the reason why costumer-NWD agreements would be useful 12:43
jelknerlack of clarity = uncertainty12:43
jelknerwe want to minimize that in our relations12:44
klariosthey should have clarity on what they are getting and how much they are paying from the beginning, regardless of how small they are12:44
jelknerklarios, yes, but for small projects like this, it's not formalism that matters, but *personal* communication12:44
jelkneryou don't need a contract12:45
jelknerjust a phone call12:45
jelknerwe are only talking about $20012:45
jelkneran invoice is the only legal document you need12:45
jelknerif you have a phone call with her, and leave the conversations feeling both you and she agree on what she will be billed for what12:46
klariosyeah I understand. A contrat wouldnt be a good idea and agreements dont have to be on paper12:46
jelkneryou can say, "I'll send you an invoice today for $nnn"12:46
jelknerthen do it!12:46
jelknershe should understand that we can't continue working if we don't get paid12:46
jelkner(we'll starve :-(12:47
jelknerklarios, i can i give you a call to talk more after our meeting?12:47
klariosalright that's true!12:47
klariosi'll be meeting with shallon 12:47
jelknerthomasboimah, no more work for Ms. Scholl until you get the go ahead from klarios 12:47
jelknerklarios, do you feel you go this?12:48
thomasboimahYes! Sir12:48
jelknergot this?12:48
klariosIve got this jelkner 12:48
jelknerokie dokie, it's in your hands12:48
jelknersweet12:48
jelknercjones, what's our plan for customer meetings for ToDo12:48
jelkner?12:48
cjonesha i ws just about to say we need a next issue for the todos project12:49
cjonesi have a proposal12:49
jelkneryou suggested that you had enough ideas to act as customer until we had a minimum viable product to deploy12:49
jelknerdo you want to still do that?12:49
jelkneri would love to file an issue, but i need to start using it first12:49
cjonessure - happy to play both customer and product manager for now12:49
cjonesthe big thing I'd like to think about is number of issues. I know that gabriel, mulbah, and thomas are all tryign to work on this12:50
jelknergreat, let's do that until you feel you have something the rest of us can start using (at a *very* basic level)12:50
cjonesand I think that the three of them sharing one issue was challenging12:50
jelknerthen we'll deploy and begin playing with it12:50
jelknerah, cjones excellent point12:51
jelknerthis is all new for them12:51
jelknerthrough this process, they will begin to learn to work as a team12:51
cjonesok, so we should continue going one issue at a time for now?12:51
jelknerjust like with customers (and most things we humans do), communication is key12:51
jelkneri'll leave that up to you12:52
jelknerbut i do have a suggestion12:52
jelkneras soon as thomasboimah feels that gabriel and mulbah are ready12:52
jelknerhe should take the lead in learning to write unit tests12:52
jelknerlong term goal would be to write tests *before* writing code12:53
jelknerbut for now just adding unit tests after will help a lot12:53
cjonescool - I know Django has a nice testing framework, but I haven't played with it. I'll be excited for that =)12:53
jelkneri used to listen to stefan and adrian discuss what they were going to do before they started working12:54
jelknerthey were an incredible team12:54
cjonesok. so I'll write a single new issue for now.12:54
cjonesthomasboimah, do you feel that the three of you can work together on the next issue okay?12:54
thomasboimahyes!12:54
jelknerthrough practice (lots and lots of practice) they learned how to communicate and plan very efficiently12:54
jelknerwhich made them very productive12:54
jelknersweet12:55
jelknerthanks for coming cjones 12:55
jelkneryour participation is a game changer for us!12:55
jelknerok, that's all i have for the group12:55
cjonesGlad to be here! before I go - FYI team I'm going on vacation Thursday - Tuesday (Aug 7-12). I don't plan to be on my email then, so I'll join back in next Wednesday12:56
jelkneri need to work with svaye and dcammue about accessing the gnucash databases12:56
klariosahh jelkner will you work with them right now?12:56
jelknerthat was the plan12:56
cjonesand @klarios - sounds like the issue with Binsuess Tracker is gone for now? So no immeidate needs there?12:56
jelknerhave fun cjones 12:56
jelknercjones, i don't think we're ready for that now12:56
jelknerlet's work around it12:57
svayeHave a nice vacation cjones 12:57
klariosnope cjones, it used to not be able to create invoices and costumers 12:57
klariosI think adrian took a look at it yesterday 12:57
klarioson his own12:57
jelknersweet12:57
cjoneskk. happy to take a look whenever I can be helpful.12:57
klariosthank you! 12:57
jelknerklarios, if adrian has time, that's wonderful12:57
cjonesotherwise, signing off for now. Take care everyone12:57
cjonesACTION logging off12:57
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jelkneri plan to reach out to the two of them to give a "master class" to thomasboimah and company when they are ready12:58
jelknerbut i don't want to bother them until we are ready12:58
klariossvaye, see you at 11 est then! jelkner you can call me after that12:58
jelknermake sense?12:58
klariosI will be busy doing tech work for madre tierra as well 12:58
svayeAlright klarios 12:58
thomasboimah+112:58
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jelknerklarios, don't overextend yourself12:58
jelknerok dcammue and svaye, do we want to try to setup your gnucash access?12:59
svayeYes!12:59
dcammue+112:59
jelknerok, hold on, i'm going to send you an email13:00
jelkneremail sent to svaye dcammue and thomasboimah 13:02
svayeJelkner are we using the same host, databases and username?13:03
jelknerdid you get the email?13:04
svayeYes13:04
jelknerthomasboimah, i'm about to make you and owner of the NOVA Web group on gitlab13:04
jelknerso that you can make any changes you need13:04
thomasboimahOkay thanks13:04
svayeI assume it's our individual password 13:04
jelkneryes, svaye, each user (role in postgres) will have their own password13:05
jelknerlike i mentioned yesterday13:05
jelknerthat will permit us much more control over who has access to what13:05
svayeAlright, which database should we log into first?13:06
jelknerthe only one you may have access to now is sjcompute13:09
jelknerwe are starting with that one13:09
jelknerthomasboimah, i did a bit of quick reading13:09
thomasboimahI'm now a maintainer jelkner 13:10
jelknerand i think the maintainer role gives you all you need13:10
jelknerlet me know if it doesn't13:10
thomasboimahYes! thanks13:10
jelknerbut i think you should be good to go13:10
thomasboimahI can now add svaye freely13:10
jelkneryup13:10
jelkner;-)13:10
jelknerwhile i have the three of you, can we talk about one more thing before i go?13:11
jelknerthomasboimah, dcammue, svaye?13:11
thomasboimahYes13:12
thomasboimahsvaye, i just send you an invite13:12
dcammue+113:12
thomasboimah+113:12
jelkneri'm waiting for your undivided attention13:12
jelknersweet, i know you have a lot to do, so i'll be quick13:12
svayeThomasboimah where did you send it?13:12
svayeThanks I see it13:13
jelknersvaye, please wait until we finish this discussion13:13
thomasboimahsvaye, let pay attention after this13:13
jelknerif you are multi-tasking13:13
jelkneri don't have your attention13:13
jelknerand i am asking for that please13:13
dcammueAttention? +113:13
svayeI am sorry about that jelkner, you have my full attention. 13:13
jelknerquick conversation about leadership and collaboration within jetro web13:13
jelkneri can't tell you how happy i am working with the 7 of you!13:14
jelkneryou are an amazing team13:14
jelkner!13:14
jelknerfreena sent a very gracious email saying she understands and supports the change we made asking svaye to take on the other full time spot13:15
jelknerthat is very mature of her13:15
jelknerit shows wisdom13:15
jelknerour goal is to turn jetro as soon as we can into a business that can support all 7 of you13:15
jelknerbut to make that happen, we need to work hard and we need to work smart13:15
jelkneri know i can count on thomasboimah, svaye, and dcammue to show up day after day on time and ready to lead13:16
jelknerthat's AWESOME!13:16
jelknerdcammue, my feeling is you should be the next full timer13:16
jelknerbased on your commitment and performance13:16
jelknerbut as you know, i can't afford that on my own13:17
jelknerso as soon as we can start generating around $400 per month from other customers13:17
jelknerwe can bring you on full time13:17
jelknermake sense?13:17
thomasboimah+113:17
jelknerthat should be our concrete financial goal13:17
svaye+113:17
jelknergreat13:18
jelknerthat's all i wanted to say13:18
jelknerone by one, we will work to bring everyone on board13:18
thomasboimahYes! that is the goal13:18
jelkneremail me if you need anything13:18
jelkneri'll be finishing setting up my classroom today13:18
jelknersee you tomorrow same time same place13:18
thomasboimahOkay have a nice day jelkner 13:19
jelkneryou too!13:19
dcammueThat's a wonderful idea13:19
dcammueYou can't force want to drop from a dry clothes jelkner. So I understand 13:19
svayeHave a wonderful day jelkner 13:19
jelkneroh, i just started the wire transfer13:19
jelknermore tomorrow on that13:19
jelknerACTION logs off for the day13:19
dcammueOkay 13:20
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svayedcammue: 13:20
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klarioshi all !15:01
svayeHi klarios, how are you doing?15:01
klariosI am well s`15:02
klariossvaye, 15:02
klariosshallon, 15:03
klariosare you connected15:03
klariosas svaye 15:04
klariosor as shallon 15:04
klarios?15:04
svayeI am connected with my phone as svaye and laptop as shallon.15:04
klariosahh 15:05
klariosI see no worries15:05
klariosgive me 5 minutes15:05
klariosi need to make you an account15:05
klariosin business tracker15:05
klariosyou've made a gitlab account right?15:05
svayeYes15:05
klarioswhat's your username?15:06
svayesvaye15:06
klarioseasy! great15:07
klariosgive me a sec15:07
klariosokay youve been added15:12
svayeTo the business tracker?15:13
klarioswhat's your email svaye ?15:13
klariosno for gitlb15:13
klariosgitlab15:13
svayevayeshallon@gmail.com15:13
klariosit asks me to add your address but its not required15:14
klarioswould you like to add your address?15:14
svayeI don't see anything about an address klarios 15:15
klariosnoo not for gitlab 15:15
klariosfor business tracker15:15
klariossince youre not based in the US I will simply not put an address for you 15:16
svayeHow do I access the business tracker?15:17
klariosokay now check your email 15:17
klariosyou should have gotten a code15:17
klariosor a link15:17
klariosto activate your account15:17
svayeI don't see it15:18
klariosI also have to add your mayfirst email15:18
klariosthat's weir15:18
klarioswerid15:18
klarioslets try your mayfirst email15:18
svayesvaye@mail.mayfirst org15:19
klariosokay we've identified another issue with business tracker (sadly)15:20
klariosI will have to email cjones about it15:20
klariosI got a error 50215:20
klariosIt seems the mail server it uses isnt up15:21
svayeThat's not good, looks like we have to get it fixed as soon as possible. 15:22
klariosyep 15:22
klarioslets write an email to the dev team 15:22
klariosplus we should bring it up next meeting as well 15:22
svayeklarios: I sent you a message yesterday, about logging in the Arlington account. 15:23
klarioson telegram?15:23
svayeYeah15:23
svayeCan I log in now?15:23
klariosahh I saw it 15:23
klariosno worries15:23
klariosdon't log in right now15:23
klariosbefore we have to make sure you can get into gnu cash 15:24
klarioswere you able to connect?15:24
klariosand do you have your password?15:24
svayeNo, Daniel and I couldn't access the database. 15:24
svayeJelkner gave us our password but it's not working. 15:24
klariosthat's weird15:25
klariosdid he tell you he'd look into it?15:25
klariosor cjones would look into it?15:25
svayeHe had to leave to set up his classroom, so we will let him know tomorrow. 15:25
klariosahh Its probably the same issue we had while setting up15:27
klarioshe will take care of it 15:27
klariosso our blockers for now are: Business tracker, and access to GNU Cash. Without that we can't really continue today15:27
klarioswe can finish setting you up with bitwarden 15:27
svayeAlright 15:28
klariosI will use your mayfirst email to invite you 15:28
klariosah! youve already been invited!!!15:28
klarioscheck your mayfirst email 15:28
klariosand look up for bitwarden 15:29
klariosclick on the invitation link15:29
svayeAlright 15:30
svayeI am logged in 15:32
klariossvaye, ive got to go at 10:40 for a costumer meeting + writing emails. Lets write an email to the dev team about business tracker 15:32
klariosGreat!15:32
klariosokay now its critical to wait for GNU cash and business tracker to work 15:32
klarioslets end it here for now15:33
svayeAlright 15:34
klariosin terms of plan for this week. We've got to check on the other developers svaye 15:34
klariosgabriel and mulbah 15:34
klariosthey are supposed to work with thomas on the To-do app15:34
klariosas business managers, we should know what theyre doing and how theyre doing  15:35
klariosin terms of progress 15:35
svayeAlright 15:35
klarioswe should learn to determine those measurements 15:36
klariosnormally it would be through hourly tracking tools or dev work tracking tools 15:37
klarioslike issues, Prs, commits, etc.15:37
klariossvaye, do you know where the git to the TO-Do app is hosted?15:38
klariosgitlab, github, codeberg?15:38
svayeCodeberg 15:38
klariosdo you have the link for it?15:38
svayeI get an email everytime a PR is posted15:38
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klariosahh youre on it15:39
klariosI've got to be on it as well 15:39
klariosI don't think i am 15:39
klarioscan you send me the link?15:39
svayeI think jelkner was the one who did it15:39
klariosit seems its not on his personal codeberg account15:40
klariosnop e15:41
klariosnot in ther e15:41
svayeGive me a minute I will send the link 15:41
klariosokay15:41
svayehttps://codeberg.org/JetroWebDevelopment/ToDos/pulls/215:43
klariosThank you svaye !15:44
klariosive got to head out now15:44
klariosthank you for your time!15:44
klariossee you on friday for our business meetings 15:44
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