IRC log of #novawebdev for Thursday, 2020-08-20

*** SITarabuta has joined #novawebdev03:49
SITarabuta!remind I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA)03:49
'I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA)' added to message queue03:49
*** SITarabuta has joined #novawebdev03:54
SITarabuta!remind03:54
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)03:54
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)03:54
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)03:54
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)03:54
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)03:54
*** jelkner has joined #novawebdev08:01
jelkner!remind08:15
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)08:15
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)08:15
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)08:15
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)08:15
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)08:15
jelkner!remind Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that)08:18
'Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that)' added to message queue08:18
jelkner!remind08:18
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)08:18
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)08:18
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)08:18
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)08:18
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)08:18
Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that) (jelkner)08:18
jelkner!remind Reminder about new schedule starting next week08:18
'Reminder about new schedule starting next week' added to message queue08:18
jelkner!remind Updating our website09:18
'Updating our website' added to message queue09:18
*** ubuntourist has joined #novawebdev09:51
jelknerGM, ubuntourist 09:56
jelknerwhat are you doing up at this crazy hour?09:56
ubuntouristMorpheus has abandoned me once more.09:56
jelknerso sorry to hear that :-(09:56
jelknergot a minute, ubuntourist?09:57
ubuntouristYea09:57
jelkneri've been looking over your links09:57
jelknerand i wanted to know what you thought about asking zOnny to give Ubuntu Studio a try?09:57
jelkneri have a laptop that would be good for it09:57
jelknerif he has interest in video editing and such, and we wanted to offer that kind of thing as a service09:58
jelknerwe would need a platform for doing so that doesn't involve our slavery to tech masters09:58
ubuntouristIt's easy enough to install, but I'm a kid in a candy store there. I've sampled a lot and become knowledgeable about very little.09:59
jelkneri was thinking Ubuntu Studio would be the most "polished" point of entry into that09:59
jelknernot expecting you to be an expert09:59
ubuntourist(That's what I'm currently running, having never been able to achieve quite the same level of integration of tools on Arch Linux.)09:59
jelknerjust asking for advice if you think my proposal makes sense09:59
jelknercool10:00
jelkneri'll talk to zOnny about that today10:00
jelknerand set it up for him on the laptop i have10:00
jelknerbtw, ubuntourist 10:00
ubuntouristThe Ubuntu Studio + KX Studio repos has been reasonably kind to me, and when there's something I think I really want, it's there.10:00
jelknerNaomi Kline is the keynote speaker for day one of the coop conference10:01
ubuntouristKlein. ;-)10:01
jelkneri just watched her 2004 movie "The Take" last night again10:01
jelknerright10:01
jelkneryou know I can't spell :-(10:01
jelkneri'm going to recommend Heylin and anyone else going watch the movie before the conference10:02
jelknerused Handbrake to rip it10:02
jelknerso now i have a 1 gig m4v file10:02
jelkner!remind10:03
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)10:03
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)10:03
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)10:03
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)10:03
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)10:03
Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that) (jelkner)10:03
Reminder about new schedule starting next week (jelkner)10:03
Updating our website (jelkner)10:03
ubuntouristInterestingly enough, I cannot fingerspell. I probably would have made the same error, were I signing it to my wife. I fingerspell "phonetically" which is ironic when talking with a deaf person.10:03
jelkner!remind USFWC Coop Conference update10:04
'USFWC Coop Conference update' added to message queue10:04
ubuntouristHmmm. !remind has regressed? to showing everyone every remind instead of privately until "Shhhowtime!".10:04
ubuntouristjelkner, BTW, I finally managed to get signed up for the conference. But really, their CiviCRM instance is a bit of a mess.10:06
jelknerubuntourist, they have a lot of things that are a mess10:07
jelknerthey are asking me to use slack10:07
jelkneri hate that10:07
jelknerslack doesn't leave you alone10:07
jelknernagware10:07
jelknernot free10:07
jelknerthis is a long term point of contention within the two movements we are part of10:08
ubuntouristMattermost is at least FLOSS... That's the argument to be made there. (Or Matrix / Riot / Element.)10:08
jelknerright10:08
jelknerbut to be fare, if participation is difficult, it won't work10:08
jelknerthat's always the argument the coop folks make10:09
jelknerwith good reason10:09
jelkner"We are trying to organize low income, technologically disadvantaged folks"10:09
jelknerwe just had the same conversation with heylin about communicating with members of our cleaning coop10:10
jelknerBCI is recommending WhatsApp10:10
ubuntouristI still find them sort of annoying, but mostly tamable. (I think you can nudge Slack into "shutting the fuck up" if you try.)10:10
jelknersince that's what most folks in the Latinx community use to communicate with family in their countries of origin10:11
jelkneri wanted to use signal10:11
jelknerdon't know what to do10:11
ubuntouristWhatsApp is a phone thing, right? I hear about it but have no real idea about it. Secure phone communication both Signal and WhatsApp, right?10:11
jelkneryes10:11
jelknerlike Signal10:12
jelkneronly worse10:12
jelknernot free10:12
jelknersurveillance model10:12
ubuntouristBTW, Julia of HacDC now who went to Germany to escape the Nazis ;-) is working for a FLOSS competitor of Signal, IIRC. I want to say the product is named "Wire".10:13
jelknerok, ubuntourist, i'm going to try to get some more work done before zOnny and inana_16 join me at 1010:13
ubuntouristLater then.10:13
jelknerubuntourist, sorry, one other question10:15
jelknerdo you know how i can access our static site?10:15
jelknerhttps://novawebdevelopment.org/public/documents/10:16
ubuntouristWhat was it you were just saying about nagware? ;-)10:16
jelknerlol10:16
ubuntouristYou mean via ssh?10:16
jelkner+110:17
jelknerdo i have an account?10:17
jelkneri don't even know what machine it is on10:17
jelkneri added the missing comment you made to the BCI survey summary10:17
jelkneri want to put it there10:17
jelknersince otherwise the link keeps changing10:17
jelkneri mean on Nextcloud10:18
ubuntouristjelkner, I think we're still "playing with fire" there and have no user accounts...10:18
jelknerahh10:18
jelknerlet me look on business tracker and see if i can figure out which machine it is10:18
jelknerand then add an account for myself10:18
ubuntouristI'm on it now.10:18
ubuntouristI can add an account for you.10:19
ubuntouristHold yer horses.10:19
ubuntouristjelkner, flint's password... so change it.10:20
ubuntouristjelkner, but I thought you wanted to add it to /public/documents/ So presumably, you'll want sudo capabilities.10:22
jelknerubuntourist, which machine is it?10:22
ubuntouristUm... novawebdevelopment.org... ;-)10:23
jelknerthat's what i thought10:23
jelkneri'm getting "permission denied (publickey) on that10:23
jelknerso maybe stefan already disabled password login?10:24
ubuntouristAh, perhaps.10:24
jelknerthat's good10:24
jelknerso i'll need to ask him to add my public key10:24
ubuntouristSo, send me the key you'd like and I can install it.10:24
jelkneroh cool10:24
jelknerhttps://pastebin.com/ZFiKVPqB10:25
jelknerand since this key is named something other than id_rsa10:26
jelkneri'll need a command line option with ssh, yes?10:27
jelknertime for me to learn to do that10:27
ubuntouristTry now.10:28
ubuntouristYou shouldn't need anything special.10:28
jelkneri'm in, you rock!10:29
ubuntouristHold.10:29
jelknernow i will change my password, update keypass, and you can give me sudo ;-)10:29
ubuntouristjelkner, you're not a sudoer10:29
ubuntouristHold.10:29
ubuntouristjelkner, ou'll need to logout and in, but you are now okay, methinks10:32
ubuntourists/ou/you/10:32
ubuntouristACTION signs off to do other things...10:33
jelkner!remind10:35
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)10:35
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)10:35
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)10:35
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)10:35
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)10:35
Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that) (jelkner)10:35
Reminder about new schedule starting next week (jelkner)10:35
Updating our website (jelkner)10:35
USFWC Coop Conference update (jelkner)10:35
jelkner!remind12:48
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)12:48
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)12:48
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)12:48
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)12:48
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)12:48
Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that) (jelkner)12:48
Reminder about new schedule starting next week (jelkner)12:48
Updating our website (jelkner)12:48
USFWC Coop Conference update (jelkner)12:48
jelkner!remind patio.ica.coop vs patio.ica.coop/chat ?12:48
'patio.ica.coop vs patio.ica.coop/chat ?' added to message queue12:48
*** inana_16 has joined #novawebdev13:03
inana_16!remind13:19
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)13:19
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)13:19
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)13:19
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)13:19
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)13:19
Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that) (jelkner)13:19
Reminder about new schedule starting next week (jelkner)13:19
Updating our website (jelkner)13:19
USFWC Coop Conference update (jelkner)13:19
patio.ica.coop vs patio.ica.coop/chat ? (jelkner)13:19
inana_16https://zulipchat.com/13:30
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louis_this is a test message to see how quickly irc logs updates13:46
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jelknerGM louisea!14:41
jelknerwe are on planning14:41
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jelknerhttp://teaching.idallen.com/cst8207/13w/notes/learning_curves.jpg15:51
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PAldea : zOnny : abuchholz : @ubuntourist : amina : SITarabuta : louisea : inana_16 : +jelkner : @mjsir911 : wolcen : @ChanServ16:00
Good afternoon everyone!16:00
It's 16:00 UTC and NOVA Web Development's bi-weekly meeting is starting.16:00
This is the agenda for today:16:00
Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!? (SITarabuta)16:00
ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/ (zOnny)16:00
About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises) (SITarabuta)16:00
Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? (SITarabuta)16:00
I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) (SITarabuta)16:00
Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that) (jelkner)16:00
Reminder about new schedule starting next week (jelkner)16:00
Updating our website (jelkner)16:00
USFWC Coop Conference update (jelkner)16:00
patio.ica.coop vs patio.ica.coop/chat ? (jelkner)16:00
Have a nice day!16:00
inana_16Helloooooo Everyoneeeee!16:00
jelknerGM, big agenda, inana_16, let's roll!16:00
abuchholzGood Afternoon and holy cow16:00
inana_16Yes, we can do it!16:00
ubuntouristTime to crack a can..16:00
inana_16:D16:00
jelknerabuchholz, much of this we discussed this morning16:00
SITarabutamaybe 2 this time ubuntourist 16:00
jelknerubuntourist helped me at 5 am ;-)16:01
SITarabutayou were absent abuchholz 16:01
abuchholzwdym16:01
abuchholzi was in the call16:01
SITarabutawait what really16:01
inana_16alright,16:01
inana_16first item: Shared access to a password manager - BitWarden!?16:01
SITarabutayes indeed16:02
SITarabutaso:16:02
SITarabutawe have many many many passwords16:02
SITarabutathat many many many of us need to access16:02
SITarabutaand storing in them in NextCloud is no better than storing them in Google Docs16:02
ubuntouristWhy not a KeypassXC database stored on the cloud, with a private key (and/or password) on each person's local machine?16:02
SITarabutawhat about *drum rolls* a password manager16:02
SITarabutaTell us inana_16 16:03
inana_16yes I'm using it ;)16:03
inana_16for personal stuff16:03
jelknerdo you like it?16:03
inana_16is really good16:03
ubuntouristBitWarden vs. KeepassXC?16:03
inana_16Yes ;)16:03
SITarabutaI haven't investigated KeypassXC, but I do know that Bitwarden is open source yada yada16:03
ubuntouristpros, cons?16:03
inana_16is easy, clean and intuitive16:03
SITarabutaone thing seems to be different ubuntourist 16:04
SITarabutaKeepassXC doesn't seem to have browser extensions16:04
ubuntouristBrowser integration is available16:04
SITarabutaor maybe it doesn't and I can't find them16:04
ubuntouristWe can do a quick demo later.16:05
jelknerproposal: can we agree we want a shared self-hosted tool for this?16:05
inana_16https://bitwarden.com/browser-start/ SITarabuta 16:05
jelknerthen SITarabuta and inana_16 and ubuntourist can decide16:05
jelknerwhich one16:05
jelkneri think we need a solution16:06
*** GFbot has joined #novawebdev16:06
jelknercan others weigh in?16:06
jelknerthen we can move on16:06
inana_16+116:06
SITarabutazOnny, abuchholz, GFbot and others16:06
abuchholzI use bitwarden16:07
abuchholzi think its great 16:07
inana_16+116:07
SITarabutalouisea, ah you changed your username ;-)16:07
ubuntouristLong agenda...16:07
SITarabutavery....16:07
inana_16let's move16:07
SITarabutalet's move on16:07
SITarabutawe'll decide16:07
SITarabutalatah ;-)16:07
inana_16next item: ask stefan about how to upload public documents /public/documents/16:07
louiseaSITarabuta, yeah, I change it frequently, to keep things fresh and interesting16:07
jelknerinana_16, ubuntourist fixed this for me16:08
SITarabutalouisea, :-)16:08
jelknerin the long term it relates to the other item16:08
jelknerbut done for now16:08
inana_16yes, just to mention that16:08
jelknerACTION done16:08
SITarabutaI uploaded documentation on how to do this on our wiki16:08
inana_16thanks16:08
SITarabutajust so others know16:08
SITarabutaACTION done16:08
inana_16next item: About all the licensed crap - are we more of a business or more of a world changer? (compromises)16:08
inana_16SITarabuta :)16:08
SITarabutaWe discussed this but really - do we want to use proprietary crap but make nice things or compromise and not use proprietary crap and let things look a little worse16:09
ubuntouristMarvel's Agents of C.H.A.N.G.E. ;-)16:09
SITarabutaThankfully this was fixed in my case - looking at you Adobe Acrobat16:09
jelknerthe later16:09
jelknera little worse is a small price to pay for freedom16:10
SITarabutawell sometimes is much worse ;-)16:10
jelknercompletely unusable would be a much tougher call16:10
jelknerfor now, we dodged this one16:10
SITarabutaindeed16:10
jelknersince LibreOffice rocks!16:10
inana_16+116:10
SITarabutaACTION done16:11
ubuntouristA lot of this stuff just has a bit of a learning curve, but can do similar stuff, e.g. Gimp, KDEnlive, etc.16:11
ubuntouristACTION is done16:11
inana_16Still on you SITarabuta : Following up the previous question, people want to pay us / use Business Tracker - will we go the LibreOrganize route with manual deployments? 16:11
SITarabutaGIMP - argh yes my nightmare16:11
SITarabutahmm16:11
inana_16+116:11
SITarabutaso about this one16:11
SITarabutaShould we dockerize it, set up a script and so forth16:11
SITarabutabut we decided16:11
SITarabutaalready16:11
SITarabutathat we choose our partners16:12
SITarabutaso16:12
SITarabutathe answer is manual16:12
jelkneraround $800 per year16:12
jelknerdockerized16:12
jelknersupport for a year16:12
jelknerACTION done16:12
zOnnyI think our principles won't like this16:12
ubuntouristVictor was bringing up cautionary tales of Docker in yesterday. (I didn't investigate.)16:12
jelknernot the tool, docker16:12
SITarabutajelkner, it is not necessary to dockerize it16:12
jelknerthe SaS docker16:12
SITarabutaif we do it like we did with libreorganize16:12
jelknerdoesn't apply to hosting yourself, ubuntourist 16:13
jelknerhe means, don't host on their site16:13
jelknerACTION done16:13
ubuntouristACTION is done16:13
SITarabutaanyway, we know how to proceed16:13
SITarabutaACTION done16:13
inana_16next item: I went nuts trying to create a new Jitsi server - too many credentials segregated everywhere (FreeIPA) 16:13
SITarabutaAh yes16:13
SITarabutavery very important16:13
SITarabutaAfter some investigation I came to the conclusion that we should really have different accounts on our servers16:14
SITarabutahowever, I don't want to manually create sitarabuta on 10 machines and get them out of sync16:14
SITarabutaso I found FreeIPA (LDAP and Kerberos)16:14
SITarabutaas well as IAR16:14
SITarabutaInternet Account Replication - successor to Linux NIS16:15
jelknerACTION agreed to talk to mattva01 tomorrow about this16:15
jelknerto get his recommendation for SITarabuta 16:15
SITarabutathey achieve similar things using totally different ways16:15
SITarabutaso yes, mattva01 needs to weigh in16:15
SITarabutaACTION done16:15
SITarabutaalso, very quickly16:15
SITarabutamaybe ubuntourist has any suggestions16:15
SITarabutaACTION is done now16:16
ubuntouristACTION doesn't. Network security and lots of machines simultaneously has never been my thing.16:16
inana_16Thanks16:16
inana_16next item: Ask zOnny to try Ubuntu Studio (I have a good laptop for that)16:16
ubuntourist+116:17
inana_16we already covered this jelkner 16:17
jelknerinana_16 zOnny and i talked about this16:17
jelknerACTION will setup Ubuntu Studio this afternoon16:17
jelknerand give laptop to zOnny on Sunday16:17
jelknerACTION done16:17
inana_16alright,16:17
inana_16next item: Reminder about new schedule starting next week16:17
jelknersunday is at the usual time, thursday is at 20:00 UTC16:18
jelknerACTION done16:18
inana_16k16:18
GFbotk16:18
inana_16next item: Updating our website16:18
inana_16regarding this, is a task I have in my todo list16:18
inana_16jelkner16:18
jelknercool, inana_16 16:18
jelkneri just wanted to keep it in focus16:19
jelknerit's an ongoing need16:19
jelknerACTION done16:19
inana_16Is just that we've been working in other things but yes, It will be done16:19
GFbotinana_16 we can do that today16:19
jelkner+116:19
inana_16MLLC first GFbot 16:20
inana_16we need to deliver that to Cesiah ASAP16:20
jelknerMDLC16:20
inana_16Nope is MD Legislative Latino Caucus16:20
GFbotwell, im ready16:20
GFbot:)16:20
inana_16Ok16:20
jelknerthis will be an ongoing discussion16:20
inana_16yes16:20
SITarabutaSo guys is it MLLC or MDLC16:21
inana_16is MLLC16:21
inana_16as the contract16:21
jelknerbalancing new work with maintenance16:21
jelknerwe need to do both16:21
inana_16+116:21
jelknerkeeping them in balance is hard16:21
jelknerbut necessary16:21
jelknerACTION done16:21
inana_16thanks jelkner 16:21
inana_16next item: USFWC Coop Conference update16:22
jelknercool16:22
jelknerregistration is open16:22
jelknerhttps://www.usworker.coop/blog/free-registration-is-now-open-for-the-worker-co-op-conference-september-10-11/16:22
ubuntouristTheir CiviCRM is still messed up but I managed to register.16:23
jelknerkeynote speaker on day one is naomi klein16:23
jelknershe has a movie i watched last night16:23
jelknerhttp://www.thetake.org/16:23
jelkneri will upload a file with it and send a link in email16:24
SITarabutatick tock16:24
SITarabutatick tock16:24
jelknerrecommed it highly!16:24
jelknerACTION done16:24
ubuntourist(As well as the whole Public Tools for Public Schools - related thing.)16:24
inana_16last item: #novawebdev- patio.ica.coop vs patio.ica.coop/chat16:24
jelknerinana_16 explained this to me16:24
inana_16regarding that I explained jelkner that is not the same thing16:24
jelknerone is a blog the other a chat16:24
jelkneri was confused because i needed two accounts16:25
jelknerACTION done16:25
ubuntouristChat, forum, blog, etc. It's "full-blow-your-stack" ;-)16:25
inana_16in patio.ica.coop you can post and create topics and join discussions16:25
jelknerbut not one auth, ubuntourist 16:25
inana_16right16:25
inana_16yes16:25
inana_16Ok, glad you got that jelkner 16:25
SITarabutaACTION steps away as the bag of gravel is going to be dropped soon16:25
ubuntouristjelkner, Yeah. Did all that. Glad you're now on board.16:25
SITarabutaACTION doesn't want to get hurt16:25
inana_16anyone has anything to add?16:25
jelknerinana_16 should throw it at him ;-)16:26
SITarabutaI am still here!16:26
inana_16ACTION drops the bag of gravel 16:26
ubuntouristKudos to yesterday's show & tell... ;-)16:26
SITarabutaI knew it ;-)16:26
jelknerwow!!16:26
inana_16lol16:26
jelknerthat was a big agenda16:26
jelknerand you came in with 4 minutes to spare, inana_16 16:26
inana_16thank you everyone16:26
jelknernice work!16:26
inana_16lol 16:26
louiseathank! I'm stepping out for lunch16:27
jelknerzOnny, ping16:27
jelknerwhat time are you going to HacDC on Sunday?16:28
jelknerzOnny?16:30
zOnnyjelkner  with u onboard does 8:00 AM works for u?16:31
jelkneryes, perfect!16:31
zOnnyUTC or ET ?16:32
jelknerzOnny, i'll be standing at the usual spot with your Ubuntu Studio laptop16:32
jelknerLoL16:32
jelkner12:00 UTC16:32
zOnnyjelkner I'm getting little  confused with the UTC crap16:32
jelkner8 AM EST16:33
jelknerhere's the best way to handle that, zOnny 16:33
jelknerhttps://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/timezone/utc16:34
jelkneroops, i was wrong16:34
jelknerit's 6 hours difference16:34
SITarabuta04:00 UTC16:34
SITarabutanvm16:34
zOnnyjelkner everything related to NWD is UTC, yes?16:34
SITarabutalol im confused16:34
jelknerzOnny, we agreed to try to use that16:35
jelknersince we have people around the world16:35
jelknerUTC is universal16:35
jelknersame time all over the world16:35
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SITarabutajelkner, 23:20
SITarabutaare you still there?23:20
jelknerI am, SITarabuta, but I'm exhausted23:20
jelknerlet's talk tomorrow23:20
SITarabutaok23:20
jelkneri've been here since 4 am23:20
jelknermy brain is mush23:20
SITarabutasure - i'll talk to you tomorrow23:21
jelkneri'll be around when you wake up tomorrow23:21
jelknerACTION signs off for the evening23:21
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